Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth invited Pastor Doug Wilson to give a sermon at the Pentagon in February as part of Hegseth's monthly Christian worship service.
The pastor's appearance was controversial.
Wilson is a self-described Christian nationalist who wants to repeal a woman's right to vote, has defended slavery and believes homosexuality should be a crime.
His beliefs are extreme, and not long ago they were considered fringe. But today, Wilson's teachings are entering the mainstream, according to religion and history scholars, including Kristin Kobes Du Mez, author of Jesus and John Wayne.
That's why Morning Edition's Leila Fadel sat down with Wilson at his Moscow, Idaho, church for NPR's Newsmakers video podcast.
In a wide-ranging interview, Wilson said he opened a D.C. "church service" because of the number of Christians who adhere to his church's teachings within the Trump administration. One of the most prominent followers is Hegseth, who attends the newly opened D.C. congregation.
"If Kamala [Harris] had won the presidency, there would have been basically zero evangelicals in the White House administration," Wilson said. "And although Donald Trump is not an evangelical by any stretch … his administration is full of them."
That's why Wilson sees an opportunity for his beliefs to be seriously considered at this moment, including the belief that eventually the U.S. should be a Christian theocracy, whereby Christian principles dictate state authority and religion and politics are tightly intertwined.
His network of churches is still very small in the United States and his beliefs represent a minority of Christians in this country. But Wilson's proximity to power, by way of his links to Hegseth, has never been more pronounced.
So does Hegseth ever seek advice from him or other pastors within the church network on policy matters?
"Not to my knowledge. Certainly not from me," Wilson told Fadel. "I think it is crucial for pastors, when it comes to situations like this, to stay in their lane. Let's say I've got thoughts on the Strait of Hormuz. I don't have security clearances. I wasn't elected to anything."
Wilson shares his thoughts on a personal blog, though, where he's written about the Iran war. He said he doesn't support forever wars, like what happened in Iraq or Afghanistan, and that Congress should be the body that declares war and that this war has gone on too long. But he said he has not communicated these concerns directly to Hegseth.
"I've written about them and he may have read them," he said. "But I've been very careful not to take my position as pastor and say, I've got a pipeline to the secretary."
Wilson added that he's "met [Hegseth] a few times" and they've "texted some."
His focus now is on growing his movement through "preaching the gospel, planting churches, starting classical Christian schools" to gradually turn the U.S. into a Christian theocracy over the course of several generations, despite the Constitution prohibiting the government from establishing an official religion.
Under that vision, Wilson told NPR that non-Christians wouldn't hold public office. Asked whether non-Christians would be allowed to vote, Wilson said, "Yes, probably," adding that there would be restrictions on public spaces for non-Christian activities.
"So probably the best illustration of this would be church bells? Yes. Minarets? No," he said.
Why?
"Because, the public space would belong to Christ," he added.
Wilson also wants to repeal women's right to vote. When asked why, he was quick to respond.
"Because it's a good idea," he said, adding that he wants it replaced with household voting, with women only voting if they are the head of their household.
In the interview, Wilson said his vision for a Christian theocracy isn't possible today, but he hopes it will be in 250 years. Today he says he's focused on banning abortion across the country and overturning a Supreme Court ruling that legalized same-sex marriage.
"Those are the fish that I would want to fry now," he said.
Wilson acknowledged that those who hold his worldview are still a minority in this country and that there are Americans who see him as a fascist. But with his church's new connections to D.C., he said something has shifted.
"Our vision of what the intersection of theology and politics should be, our theopolitical vision, is closer to getting a hearing," he said.
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